Radical Agenda Podcast

Radical Agenda S06E045 - Trail of Destruction

Radical Agenda S06E045 – Trail of Destruction

Radical Agenda
Radical Agenda
Radical Agenda S06E045 – Trail of Destruction
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I woke up this morning quite satisfied with myself. I had written what was to be today’s episode of more than 4,000 words early yesterday morning. I was quite impressed with what I had produced, especially given that, the prior morning, I had penned another 4,000 or so words that was so good I had to put a stamp on it and mail it to my parents.

So, this morning, I didn’t go through any of my normal show day routines of scrambling to come up with content for the evening. No Revolver, no Drudge report. No seeking inspiration. I could pull up news fodder anytime before 9:30 and so long as I had my fire opening monologue prepared, I had no time pressures for show prep.

I took it easy, save for some abdominal exercises. Instead of sitting in my chair at my desk between sets, I took to my bed, and fine tuned a few things on my laptop I’ve been meaning to get to. I wrote 3,000 words about gaming and game streaming. Fired off a couple of emails…

Then, I get a text message, and as soon as I see who it is from, I know my day has taken a turn for the worse. It’s Jason Kessler.

 

 

Since I have been released from prison I have made a very sincere effort to put strict limits on the amount of conflict I engage in, particularly among other dissident right personalities. Even when the other party is wrong, even when I might do some good by raising an alarm, even when I despise the person, I am hyper conscious of efforts by those who have none of our interests at heart, to turn us against one another. This to see the most possible damage inflicted upon the movement, with the least risk and effort to them.

I think I can safely say that the only exceptions I have made to this have been Andrew Anglin, weev, Nick Fuentes, and Jason Kessler.

 

Of these, Kessler warrants the most negative attention. He is by no means the most malicious of these examples, and certainly not the most capable. Indeed, what makes Jason dangerous is precisely the fact that he comes across as a socially awkward fool whose many disasters may be summed up to the errors of a bumbling idiot. This allows him to get second, third, fourth, and fifth chances, from people who wrongly assume that he has the best intentions. This allows him to inflict maximum damage on those who are so unfortunate to come into contact with him, and universally, without fail, all who come into contact with Jason, come out worse for the experience.

It is because of this that I have taken this extraordinary step of devoting an entire opening monologue to warning you about one otherwise insignificant man, and delayed by at least one week the release of something truly wonderful which I am very proud of and anxious to share.

 

Though one need not be a regular Radical Agenda listener to know the name Jason Kessler, and those who follow the show know the name all too well, it is still yet prudent that we begin at the time that most people would have heard that name first. This being in the lead up to the Unite the Right Rally, in Charlottesville, Virginia of August 2017. This was when I first head of Jason. If memory serves, he was introduced to me by Augustus Invictus, though I hold my lawyer friend blameless for this.

 

Jason was something of a figurehead for the Unite the Right Rally, but the organization had appropriately been yanked from his hands well prior to the event. He was not capable of managing something of that calibre, and the people around him understood this quite well.

When one spends a few minutes talking to Jason, this becomes painfully evident. He does not particularly care to understand the subjects he discusses. As a notable example, he posted to Telegram on September 8th 2023 that he was “belatedly trying to understand a lot of history related to Jewish power in the 21st century”. To do this six years subsequent to UTR seems belated indeed. That never stopped Jason from talking about this subject prior to beginning the research, of course. He would simply parrot those things he heard from others as a means to mimic a pattern of speech and try to fit in with a given crowd.

He does this with everything in his life, mimicking the behavior of the people he sees in an effort to obtain the results he desires. He often lacks any understanding of what he is saying or doing, he is only acting out the behaviors he observes.

 

This sometimes causes Jason to take tremendous risks, and to the uninformed observer, it can make Jason Kessler appear to be a very brave man. There was a time when I admired his courage, until I realized that Jason is psychologically incapable of making accurate threat assessments. He would simply walk into crowds of violent Antifa criminals and say the things most likely to anger them. To observe this you might at first think it a very masculine thing to do, but one day I observed his behavior in a way that shed new light on the matter.

As Jason was on video having a verbal altercation with these criminals, his phone was violently knocked from his hand by one of his assailants. He took his eyes off the threat to grab the phone off the ground without any hesitation, and made no effort to track the people around him as he did this. With his phone back in his hand, he continued to argue as if no danger existed. Men stood behind him while he argued with women and he paid the men no mind. It then occurred to me that Jason was not knowingly facing down danger, but that Jason had no idea he was in danger.

Understanding this phenomenon brings great clarity to all that Jason does. It is often said that he is “on the spectrum” and while I am in no position to make a specific diagnosis, it is very clear that Jason does poorly with social cues as a general matter, and is congenitally incapable of improving upon this deficiency.

 

Any observation of Jason’s social media will reveal that he is profoundly discontent with all of his relationships. He invariably blames these problems on others. In the six years I have known him, not once have I ever seen him take the blame for anything, ever. It does not seem to occur to him at all that he is the only constant feature in a very diverse and lengthy history of catastrophic failures.

It is not as a consequence of today’s unpleasant exchange that I mention this. I said this all the way back on June 28th 2018, in a blog post titled “Follow Jason Kessler at Your Peril“.

Jason was at this time trying to organize a second Unite the Right Rally. At first, I was supportive of this effort because I despised the cowardice of those who said we needed to get off the streets just because criminals were attacking us when we showed up. Violent opposition is a predictable phase on the path to power, and men who lack the stomach to brave it are unfit to govern.

But it was during this time that I observed Jason’s incident with the phone, and though I had quite enough on my plate, it was a common occurrence at that time for people to come to me for guidance about what to do as other movement leaders proved incapable of withstanding the pressures brought to bear against us in the wake of the rally. Some of the best people this movement has ever seen are names you will never know, and those people devoted themselves to helping Kessler with this event. His incapacity for self reflection, and his wholly unwarranted arrogance, make a volatile concoction when mixed with his quick temper. Those hard working, intelligent, capable people sought nothing in return for their diligent efforts. Not money, not recognition, only the satisfaction of service to a worthwhile cause. We are unfortunate not to be able to tell you their names, and put their faces on posters, because they genuinely represent the best that any political movement can ask for in an adherent.

Those excellent people, could not put up with his ineptitude and abuse of subordinates.

They came to me, asking what to do, and though I at first asked that they endure, it eventually came to pass that I could no longer ask this of them while remaining of clear conscience.

Though others had done so prior, it was at this point, I felt compelled to issue my first public warning about Jason Kessler.

Speak privately with any other organizer of UTR1 and they will tell you that working with Kessler was a nightmare. Talk to Jason, and he will say the same of them. I see no reason to settle the dispute. It would seem all parties are equally correct. I relied on them, and look what happened to me.

Since my release, Jason has repeatedly called me voicing his frustrations with movement figures and those who have attempted to help him organize UTR2. I’ll not name names, but suffice it to say that at least two of the most dedicated behind the scenes people have bailed on Jason in utter despair at his handling of matters. The importance of the work these people have done cannot be overstated. I might still be in jail without them.

So thin has become the manpower at Jason’s disposal, he has someone who I will simply say is not a white man handling some upper management position. When it is mentioned to Jason that this indicates a problem for his White Nationalist demonstration, he goes into a fit about not being a racist.

Still, any of this might be overcome, save for the only dealbreaker which I will now finally communicate. Jason is incapable of processing constructive criticism. Any effort to point out any flaw in anything he does is received as an attack, and he instantly becomes irrationally defensive. Anyone reading this who has any leadership experience whatsoever immediately recognizes this as a catastrophic flaw in someone who would seek to manage anything so perilous as a bake sale.

But this is no bake sale. This is an attempt to repeat a controversial political demonstration which is vehemently opposed by a corrupt government and violent communists, the first incarnation of which already erupted into lethal violence, unprecedented media hysteria, and previously unimaginable abuse of the legal system.

We need men who are brave enough to continue on in the face of such adversity. I applaud the courage of all those who are willing to do so, and in time we will find a righteous application for your valor.

However, my conscience compels me to warn you that if you follow Jason into this mess in just a few short weeks, I fear your virtues may be wasted on the most predictable failure of the century.

The thought that men would put their lives in danger to follow this man was too much for me. If Jason cannot handle hard working volunteers who do the tedious and inglorious things, he could certainly not be trusted to lead brave men into danger.

The UTR2 event occurred, sorta. A handful of people got together in Washington DC, many miles from Charlottesville. Instead of being framed by the media as a menace to society, it was mocked as pitiful, and this was by no means one of their many deceptions.

 

Though one could occupy volumes discussing Jason’s many errors and malicious acts, time constraints force us to fast forward. At the civil trial that bore his name, Sines v. Kessler in the Western District of Virginia, before Judge Moon, Jason promptly threw his codefendants under the bus, deriving precisely zero benefit from these shameful displays, and having precisely zero reason to believe that any benefit stood to be gained.

Jason’s own words were the most damning of any at the trial. Trying to blame the event on others was a preposterous strategy. Only by demonstrating that no conspiracy existed could we have stood any chance of victory, and men who are trying to blame things on other people are thereby implying that there is guilt to be found.

Here is one of the more damning segments of the trial transcript, where Jason is being examined by Plaintiffs’ Counsel Karen Dunn.

BY MS. DUNN:
Q So in this post, Mr. Kessler, you begin by saying”@everyone.” So you direct your post to every single person in the #alt-right-events-projects server; do you see that?

A Yes, ma’am.

Q Then you go on to say, “I think we need to have a Battle of Berkeley situation in Charlottesville.”

A Yes.

Q “Bring in the alt-right, Proud Boys, Stickman, Damigo,Spencer, and fight this shit out.” You see that?

A Yes, ma’am.

Q All right. And Nathan Damigo, the jury has heard, has become nationally known at this time for punching a counter-protester that you refer to as Moldylocks.

A I don’t know what he has or hasn’t done. He did punch a woman that was referred to as Moldylocks, yes.

Q And Stickman is Kyle Chapman, who also had become known for striking a counter-protester with a leaded stick. You know that, right?

A He got into some fights in Berkeley.

Q And he’s called Stickman because he hit somebody with a leaded stick. You know that, right?

A Yes.

Q And you say that we should bring them in and fight this shit out. You see that?

A Yes, ma’am.

Q And you go on to say, “The Antifa are totally disrespecting us and the media is playing the mayor’s fiddle.Just like in Berkeley, the city council is directly tied to Antifa. I think we need a publicized event at this time. They bring everything they’ve got and we do too.” You see that you say that, right?

A Yes, ma’am.

Q And when you say “they bring everything they’ve got,”you’re referring to Antifa, correct?

A Yes, the violent left wing extremists —

Q And you wanted Antifa to bring everything that they’ve got. You see that, right? That’s what you’re saying?

A They do that always.

Q And you’re saying, that’s your idea, they bring everything we’ve got. And then you say, we do too. And when you say “we do too” refers to the alt-right, correct?

A Yes, to the permitted demonstration we will defend ourselves —

Q Thank you, Mr. Kessler. Your counsel will have —

THE COURT: You answered the question. Go ahead.

MS. DUNN: Thank you, Your Honor.

Q And you wanted the event to be publicized. In all caps you write that. You see that?

A Yes, ma’am.

Q And so you would also agree, would you not, that if there was fighting in the streets, that would create more publicity?

A It probably would, yeah.

Q All right. Let’s show Mr. Kessler PX-551.(Plaintiff Exhibit 551 marked.)

Q So Mr. Kessler, you’ll recognize this as a Discord post from May 20th, the day before your previous post, the post that we just saw. Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q All right. And I assume we can agree you went by MadDimension on Discord?

A Right.

Q Sometimes you went by Zebo, right?

A Yes, ma’am.

MS. DUNN: Move to admit 551, please.

THE COURT: Be admitted.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 551 admitted.)

Q So in this post, which is the day before you propose an event where “we fight this shit out,” you wrote, “The alt-right is a dangerous movement. It feeds on the chaos energy of our unchecked racism bantz but in IRL activism” — that’s in real life — “you have to be more like a civil rights movement for whites. It’s difficult to say that you can contain that manic energy and maintain the enthusiasm.” You say, “I’m not really sure but I wonder about it. I would go to the ends of the earth to secure a future for my people with or without the funny bantz. This is war.”Do you see that you said that?

A Yes, ma’am.

Q And bantz refers to banter or joking, right?

A Exactly.

Q It’s like lulz?

A Yes.

Q And you didn’t need jokes, Mr. Kessler. You didn’t need the bantz because this was serious to you, correct?

A I don’t — I’m not really clear on what you mean.

Q What I mean is that you said, “I would go to the ends of the earth to secure a future for my people with or without the funny bantz.”

A Well, what I’m saying is that the alt-right has a lot of edgy humor online and I think it’s counterproductive. That’s why I was saying I think it’s better for us to be a civil rights movement for whites. So I was discouraging doing the racist humor that they do online. I was saying we need to drop that and be serious.

Q Right. Exactly. You didn’t need the bantz; for you this was war. That’s what you said?

A That’s what I said, yeah.

Q And the day before your post about fighting this shit out,you say, “the alt-right is a dangerous movement.” You see that you said that?

A Yes.

MS. DUNN: All right. Mr. Spalding, let’s show Mr. Kessler PX-1395, please.
(Plaintiff Exhibit 1395 marked.)
Q So Mr. Kessler, you recall that initially you had a secret Facebook chat group to plan Charlottesville 2.0?

A Secret. So by saying “secret,” you make it sound like people normally publicize their chats to everybody on the Internet. I did have a chat group.

Q Mr. Kessler, do you recognize this PX-1395 as a text that you sent on June 5th to somebody named Baked Alaska?

A Yes.

MS. DUNN: All right. Move to admit 1395.

THE COURT: Be admitted.
(Plaintiff Exhibit 1395 admitted.)

Q And Mr. Kessler, in this text of June 5th, 2017, you say,”Are you on Facebook? A lot of our planning is happening in a secret chat.” Do you see that?

A Yes, ma’am.

Q And when you’re talking about planning, you’re talking about planning for Charlottesville 2.0, correct?

A Probably so at this time period, yeah.

Q Okay.

MS. DUNN: Mr. Spalding, can we show Mr. Kessler PX-1461B, please.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1461B marked.)

BY MS. DUNN:

Q All right. So Mr. Kessler, I’m sure you’ll agree with meyou posted an incredible amount on social media.

A Yeah. Way too much.

Q And in Facebook you went by the name “Ambien Falcon,”correct?

A At times, yes.

Q So you recognize — you can see your name, Ambien Falcon,there, and you’re talking to a group of people. Do you see that?

A Yes.

MS. DUNN: Move to admit 1461B.

THE COURT: Be admitted.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1461B admitted.)

Q And just for the sake of the jury and all of us, the Facebook chats you have to read from the bottom up, whereas Discord posts you read from the top down. So in this chat from May 22nd, at noon you say, “I just got off the phone with Based Stickman and he’s on board.” Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q And then you go on to say, “Communists deserve to be culled.” Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q And then you say, “There is no getting along. We have to fight for our future.”

A Right.

Q Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q And at your deposition you were asked whether Stickman,who we’ve identified as Kyle Chapman, who had struck somebody with a leaded stick, whether he ultimately attended the Unite the Right, and you said he did not, correct? Do you remember that?

A That sounds accurate.

Q Right. And you remember that you said that he didn’t want to share the stage with the less moderate people, correct?

A Right.

Q And you were asked, “And the more extreme people want out as far as the tone of the rally, correct?” And your answer was”Yes.” Do you recall that?

A Can you repeat that.

Q You were asked this question, Mr. Kessler, and you gave this answer: “And the more extreme people want out as far as the tone of the rally, correct?” Answer: “Yes.”A Okay. I trust you. If I said that, I said it.Q And so Based Stickman, who had hit someone with a leaded stick, is the more moderate in that statement –A We’re talking about ideologically. His politics are much more like a Trump supporter. He’s not like a white advocate or something.

Q Right. But when you say more moderate, you’re talking about Based Stickman as opposed to the people who —

MR. KOLENICH: Objection, asked and answered.

Q — ultimately attended?

MR. KOLENICH: It’s asked and answered, Your Honor.

THE COURT: Overruled. Go ahead, answer.

Q Correct?

A Can you repeat the question.

Q I said, when you talk about more moderate, you’re talking about Based Stickman as opposed to the people who ultimately attended?

A Yes. Based Stickman’s views, correct.

Q So ultimately, in addition to the secret Facebook chats,you had a Discord server for Charlottesville 2.0, correct?

A Yes.

Q We’ve talked a lot about that in this case. And you were identified, Mr. Kessler, as the event coordinator and as a moderator for the Charlottesville 2.0 server, correct?A I was definitely an event coordinator and a moderator.Q And as the event coordinator, you knew you had the ability to manage the channels and the messages, right?

A Yeah, there were some functions like that.

Q Right. And you knew that you had the ability to do that?

A Yes.

Q And you also had the ability to remove or ban members from the Discord chats, right?

A Correct. Any moderator did.

Q Right. And so if we see somebody posting on the Charlottesville 2.0 server, that’s someone you had the ability to ban, but you did not?

A Theoretically.

Q Fair to say, though, right?

A Yes.

Q From June 7th to August 11th you were on the Charlottesville 2.0 Discord server every day?

A Probably, yeah.

Q Well, not just probably, Mr. Kessler. Actually, right?

A That sounds right.

Q Okay.

MS. DUNN: Mr. Spalding, can we show the witness 3548, please.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 3548 marked.)

Q Mr. Kessler, you recognize this as a Discord chat from yourself in the #general channel of the Discord Stuff server,correct?

A Yes.

MS. DUNN: Your Honor, move to admit 3548 and show the jury.

THE COURT: Be admitted.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 3548 admitted.)

Q So, Mr. Kessler, this is a post by you where you tell everybody on Discord that Unite the Right would also be known as the Battle of Charlottesville; do you see that?

A Yes.

Q And publicly you did call it Unite the Right, but on Discord and privately you called it the Battle of Charlottesville?

A It looks like I called it both here.

Q But you don’t disagree that publicly you didn’t make posters that said the Battle of Charlottesville, right?

A No, I didn’t make any posters like that.

MS. DUNN: Mr. Spalding, if we could show the witness 968.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 968 marked.)

BY MS. DUNN:

Q And you recognize this to be a post by you as well, right?A Yes.

MS. DUNN: Your Honor, we move 968 to show the jury.

THE COURT: Be admitted.

Q And you called Charlottesville in Discord the East Coast Berkeley, correct?

A Yes.

Q And we recall that you had initiated this conversation in the post we saw earlier by saying “we need to have a Battle of Berkeley situation in Charlottesville.” You remember that?

A Yes.

Q And you tell everybody on Discord to assemble every –let’s say every person you can. Do you see that?

A Yeah, it says “assemble every motherfucker you can.”

Q We can take that down, Mr. Spalding. Let’s show the witness 1455. Actually, we can also show the jury. This has been previously admitted. This is the text exchange that the jury has already seen between Mr. Kessler and Mr. Spencer. And it’s a text exchange from June 5th of 2017. You tell Mr. Spencer that you’re going to start promoting Charlottesville 2.0, Unite the Right, the Battle of Charlottesville; do you see that?

A Yes.

Q And if you scroll down in this text chain, you say to him,”We’re raising an army my liege for free speech, but the cracking of skulls if it comes to it.” You see that, correct?

A Yes.

Q All right. Well, let’s talk about the army. One of the first people that you reached out to was Matthew Heimbach, the chairman of the Traditionalist Worker Party. Do you remember that?

A No, I don’t remember if he was the first one, but I did reach out to him.

Q Right. You reached out to him on May 22nd, so the day after you had told everybody on Discord that you wanted to fight this shit out in Charlottesville. Does that ring a bell?

A If you say that that’s accurate, I have no reason not to believe you.

Had I one whiff of any of this, I would not have attended that fucking event. I certainly would not have told any of you to go there. Jason was unambiguously looking for a fucking fight, and not one in which he himself would shed his own blood, of course. You see plenty of videos of fighting from that event, you do not see Jason putting his own body on the line in any of those brawls. The first time Jason gets hit is when he had the damn press conference after the event, and he had every expectation of being safe there because he was surrounded by police.

It is beyond bizarre to think that Kolenich would not have explained to Jason in advance of his deposition, much less the trial, that seeking to frame one’s violence as self defense does not excuse him from actively seeking a violent confrontation. But in this exchange, Jason has basically confessed to the allegation of seeking a violent conflict. That phrase “The Battle of Charlottesville” was repeated ad nauseam by the Plaintiffs. As was the comment about “An East Coast Berkeley”.

Having this intent at an event in which you are inviting neo-Nazis, calling them dangerous, it’s arguable he has confessed to everything but the conspiracy here already.

And skipping ahead some, it only gets worse.

Jason actively planned with other people to get Antifa to come to the event, and very intentionally hoped that they would attack us. He talked about leaking information to them. He talked about telling people to conceal their firearms with the specific intent of not scaring Antifa away so a fight would ensue. He told people to bring weapons, knowing that he was also planning to make certain they were attacked. On his permit application, he did not request street closures. He lied about the number of people he expected to attend, and he told other people to lie.

There’s you’re fucking conspiracy. Sorry to say.

Q Now, this is a Facebook chat from June of 2017 with somebody named Colton Merwin, who was associated with the Maryland chapter of the Proud Boys. Mr. Merwin asks you — and remember, we have to read these from the bottom up. So Mr. Merwin asked you on June 28th, “What’s the situation with Antifa? Are they coming?” And you respond, “I don’t know yet. I hope so.”And then this is an anomaly in Facebook chats, sometimes you can’t tell who’s saying what. But one of you says, “I’m ready to throw down.” Was that you or Mr. Merwin, do you recall?

A I don’t recall.

Q And then you respond, “It’s really up to the Antifa not torespond and not be pussies.” Do you see that you wrote that?

A Yes.

Q “I would suggest taunting them a little on social media.”Do you see that?

A Yes.

MS. DUNN: All right. Mr. Spalding, we can take thatdown. Please show Mr. Kessler 3560. These are Mr. Kessler’s posts.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 3560 marked.)

BY MS. DUNN:

Q Mr. Kessler, these are your posts from July 14th in the Charlottesville 2.0 server #general channel.

A Got it.

MS. DUNN: Your Honor, move to admit 3560.

THE COURT: Be admitted.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 3560 admitted.)

BY MS. DUNN:

Q If we could go to the page with the photo. Thank you, Mr. Spalding.

All right. Mr. Kessler, your first post here asks,”Anyone from New York can invite this guy to the rally?” And then you post a photo with a label that says “Antifa manlet emo screamer Nicholas says meme Antifa to get them to play the event.” Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q Then you say, “I want to talk shit but as the event organizer I can only do so much. People need to bullycide them into confronting the alt-right in Charlottesville.” Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q And you did not feel that as the organizer you couldbullycide Antifa, correct?

A Yes.

Q Well, I guess”?

A That’s what I said.

Q Is that what you said?

A Yes.

Q Yes. And you would agree, Mr. Kessler, that as theorganizer of the event there were things that you would not do,and instead other people would do them, correct?

A I don’t know. It depends on the context.

Q I’m asking you generally. As the organizer of the event,there were things that you did not do and instead you askedother people to do them?

A I definitely delegated some tasks.

Q Right. Because there were things you didn’t want to do asthe organizer, correct?

A I definitely delegated some tasks.

MS. DUNN: Your Honor, please direct the witness. Weask the Court to direct the witness to answer the question.

THE COURT: Well, I don’t know it’s — he can explain. You’re asking him to agree to something more than yes or no.

BY MS. DUNN:

Q So, Mr. Kessler, as the organizer of the event, there werethings that you — like in this Discord post, you wanted tokeep separate from yourself and you wanted other people to do them, right?

A I wouldn’t agree with your statement, “like in this Discord post.” I was horsing around here. This was not a serious discussion.

Q How about generally?

A Yeah, generally, yes, I did delegate some tasks that Ididn’t have time to do or whatever.

Q Or you didn’t want to do. You didn’t think you should doas the organizer, right?

A I was very busy. I was fighting a battle with the ACLU ata certain point in this situation. I had serious duties. Iwas talking with the police.

Q Okay.

MS. DUNN: Mr. Spalding, will you show Mr. Kessler 1432A, please.

BY MS. DUNN:

Q Mr. Kessler, you’ll recognize this as another Facebookconversation in the group RVA Anticom that you were a part of,yes?

A Let me look and make sure. I’m trying to do this quickly.I’ll just stipulate that I’m in there if you say, so we can getmoving.

MS. DUNN: Your Honor, we move to admit 1432A.THE COURT: Be admitted.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1432A marked.)

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1432A admitted.)

MS. DUNN: Mr. Spalding, if we could show Mr. Kessler the conversation that begins, “We need a new way to tip off Antifa.” Do you see that?

BY MS. DUNN:

Q All right. Mr. Kessler, on June 14th of 2017 you posted,”We need a new way to tip off Antifa when we want them to showup somewhere. Someone who can send photos and tips to their members. Either with a fake account or some apolitical normie who will do it on our behalf.”

And then Shane Goode says, “I can probably get my girl to use her account to do it. Just let me know what to do.” And then you respond, “That would be cool. We definitely want to play these people into our hands Saturday in Charlottesville.”Do you see that?

A Yes, ma’am.

Q And Saturday in Charlottesville is August 12th?A I’m not sure about that because this is way back in June. So I couldn’t say about that.

Q Okay. So it’s possible that you were trying to get Antifa to come to other events before Charlottesville 2.0 and you’re talking about some other event here?

A It’s possible. My memory is not perfect on this issue.This is really in the weeds.

Q Okay. So you’re going to deny that that Saturday in Charlottesville is some other Saturday when you were planning some sort of event in Charlottesville —

MR. KOLENICH: Objection. Mischaracterizes what hesaid. He said his memory is not perfect on this issue. He didn’t say he was denying anything.

THE COURT: Okay. You can ask him a question and clear it up.

BY MS. DUNN:

Q Thank you. Mr. Kessler, you’re going to deny that”Saturday in Charlottesville” meant Saturday, August 12th in Charlottesville?

A As I said, I don’t remember.

Q Let’s show Mr. Kessler Plaintiffs’ Exhibit 1034. You’llrecognize this as a Discord post in the #announcements channelof Charlottesville 2.0 Discord server?

A Yes, I do.

MS. DUNN: Your Honor. I move to admit PX 1034,please?

THE COURT: Be admitted.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1034 marked.)

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1034 admitted.)

BY MS. DUNN:

Q So this is another message you write to @everyone in theDiscord server. And it’s from June 7th of 2017, and it’s underthe heading “Regarding self-defense”; do you see that?

A Yes, ma’am.

Q You write, “Sticks and shields. I recommend you bringpicket signposts, shields and other self-defense implementswhich can be turned from a free speech tool to a self-defense weapon should things turn ugly.” You were referring here to picket signposts, shields andother implements as self-defense weapons, right?A They could potentially be if things turned ugly. That’s the key phrase.

Q That’s what you say, correct?

A Yes.

Q Then under the topic “Open Carry,” you say, “Please do notopen carry. We want to avoid that optic for both the media andAntifa. We ultimately don’t want to scare them from layinghands on us if they can’t stand our peaceful demonstration.”You see that?

A That’s correct.

Q Right. Because it’s fair to say you didn’t want to scareAntifa from laying hands on you and your group, right?A Ma’am, this is a common tactic that even Martin LutherKing used, was to put people out front and be attacked –MS. DUNN: Your Honor, move to strike.THE COURT: Just answer the question.

THE WITNESS: Yes.

BY MS. DUNN:

Q Yes is your answer?

A Yes.

Q Yes. All right.

MS. DUNN: Mr. Spalding, please show Mr. Kessler PX-952.

BY MS. DUNN:

Q You’ll recognize this as another exchange with you andother people from the #general channel of the Charlottesville2.0 server. Do you recognize that? If you scroll down, Mr. Spalding, Mr. Kessler can see his name.

A I see my name is there, yes.

MS. DUNN: Your Honor, move to admit 952, please.

THE COURT: Be admitted.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 952 marked.)

(Plaintiff Exhibit 952 admitted.)

Q So these are posts from the next day, June 8th, on the Charlottesville 2.0 server. Someone named Saint Charles postson June 8th of 2017, “It’s not even about optics. If we want achance to beat down Antifa, showing off guns so that it’s justa screaming match isn’t the way to do it. If we want something decisive, we shouldn’t have something deterring them from attacking us.” Do you see that?

A I see.

Q And if you go down to page 7 of this Discord chat, you cansee your response. You say — you say, “I 100 percent agreewith @SaintCharles. If you want a chance to crack some Antifaskulls in self-defense, don’t open carry. You will scare the shit out of them and they’ll just stand off to the side.” Do you see that?

A I see that I said that, yes.

Q Let’s look at PX-1461C. This is a Facebook chat involvingyou. Do you see that?

A Yes. I do.

Q Okay.

MS. DUNN: Your Honor, move to admit 1461C.THE COURT: Be admitted.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1461C marked.)

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1461C admitted.)

BY MS. DUNN:

Q All right. And here you’re in a Facebook group chat with a group, Charlottesville Anticom. And again we’re reading from the bottom up. You write on July 7, 2017 to @CJ Ross: “Canyou guys conceal carry? I don’t want to scare Antifa off from throwing the first punch.” Do you see that?

A Antifa throwing the first punch, yes, I do see that.

Q You wrote that?

A Yes.

Q You say, “We are going to have lots of armed military vetsin attendance. So we’re not going to be lacking for firepower.” Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q And then CJ Ross responds about the concealed carry. He says, “Some people are fighting him on that. They want to open carry.” Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q “If that’s the case, perhaps we can get together with them and coordinate somewhere to put them until anything breaks out.” Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q And when it says “put them,” that’s talking about theguns?

A This is another —

Q So I just want to make sure —

A I don’t know who this guy is. I mean, I talked to him,but it’s been a long time.

Q Okay. But I understand that you spoke to people who sometimes you didn’t know their identities. I’m just asking in this post, where he says “Some people want to open carry. If that’s the case, perhaps we can get together with them and coordinate somewhere to put them until anything breaks out.”And I want to ask you whether the “them” is referring to the guns?

A It could be. I can’t — I can only speculate as to whatanother individual intended.

Q Okay. Well, let’s then look at your next post. You say,”The main thing is I just don’t want a lot of big scary gunsout there that will keep Antifa away. I want them to start something.” Do you see that, Mr. Kessler?

A Yes.

Q And you wrote that, “I want them to start something”? That’s something you wrote —

A Yes, ma’am.

Q — in July of 2017?

A Yes.

Q All right. We talked a little bit before about Derrick Davis. You said that you acknowledged he was somebody you considered a friend, and he was also the regional director of the Traditionalist Worker Party. And I, just for the sake of the jury, I’d like to put up 2435 that’s been admitted into evidence so that they can see who Derrick Davis was. So that’s Derrick Davis, right?

A Yes.

MS. DUNN: All right. And Mr. Spalding, if you would show Mr. Kessler 699.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 699 marked.)

BY MS. DUNN:

Q Mr. Kessler, you can see from this Discord chat that in the list of PR representatives who were going to work on Charlottesville 2.0, Derrick Davis is the Traditionalist Worker Party representative?

A Yes.

Q Do you see that? Eli Kline is the Identity Evropa representative, for example?

A Yes.

Q All right. Mr. Spalding, can you show Mr. Kessler –MS. DUNN: Oh, I apologize. Move to admit 0699.(Plaintiff Exhibit 699 admitted.)

BY MS. DUNN:

Q Let’s show Mr. Kessler PX-1444A, please. This is — youhad quite a lot of Facebook messages directly with DerrickDavis. You don’t disagree with that, do you?

A I definitely talked to him on Facebook.

Q And sometimes it was just the two of you, right? Like inthis conversation it says at the top, “conversation withDerrick Davis”?

A Looks that way, yes.

MS. DUNN: Your Honor, move to admit 1444A.

THE COURT: Be admitted.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1444A marked.)
(Plaintiff Exhibit 1444A admitted.)
BY MS. DUNN:

Q And on June 7th, which was — is actually the same date assome of the posts we were just looking at earlier, you say, “Itmay take a little extra prodding to get” — I want to make sureMr. Spalding can find this. It’s June 7th at 3:59. “It may take a little extra prodding to get SURJ out tothe Double Horseshoe.” Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q And SURJ is Stand Up for Racial Justice, right? That’sthe acronym?

A Yes. That’s what it stands for.

Q And Double Horseshoe is a bar?

A Yes.

Q And you say, “I know how to make sure SURJ shows up.” Yousee that, right?

A Yes.

Q “Tell them you think we’re with Richard Spencer.”

A Yes.

Q And Derrick Davis says, “All right, then. You got anyonewho could pass for Spencer from behind?” Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q And then you say, “I don’t think so, really.” There’sonly one Richard Spencer, right? You don’t say that, butthat’s the case, right?

A I say “I don’t think so really.”

Q Right. And then you say — you put a quote because this is what you’re saying should be posted, “Jason Kessler and his group of fascists are meeting with Richard Spencer right now at Double Horseshoe. They’re talking about the August 12th event.” Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q And Derrick Davis says, “I was thinking along those lines.” And that’s something you wanted posted so that SURJ would see it and go to the Double Horseshoe, correct?

A Apparently, yes.

MS. DUNN: Let’s move to 1444B. Oh, actually, Iapologize, 1444C.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1444C marked.)

BY MS. DUNN:

Q This is another chat between you and Derrick Davis. Doyou see that?

A Yes.

MS. DUNN: Your Honor, move to admit 1444C.THE COURT: Be admitted.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1444C admitted.)

BY MS. DUNN:

Q Mr. Spalding, if we could show the witness and the jurythe text that — or the chats that begin with — I think youneed the two from the other page. It starts with, “Should we alert Antifa for Thursday’smeet-up or just the Proud Boys event on Saturday?” Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q And Derrick Davis says, “Your call.” Up to you, right?

A Yes.

Q And you respond, “Tell them something like Kessler’s groupis meeting on the Downtown Mall Thursday night. Even moretroubling is that he’s organizing the neo-Nazi Proud Boys groupto meet downtown on Saturday, presumably to plan for his August12th rally. As we’ve already seen, militia leader Based Stickman has retweeted Kessler about the event.” You see that you said that?

A Yes.

Q And that’s the quote you’re offering to be posted,correct?

A Yes.

Q You also say, “We have to resist the Proud Boys coming toour city. Anyone who says that we should back down to these terrorists is supporting their violence and racism being normalized in our communities.” That’s what you’re suggesting Derrick Davis make sure be posted, correct?

A Yes.

Q One question. On the Proud Boys, that you refer to the neo-Nazi Proud Boys, you were a member of the Proud Boys at this time, correct?

A Very briefly, but I don’t think that they’re a neo-Nazi group. This was all in quotes. This is the way I view liberals as speaking about events.

Q I understand. And this is what you wanted posted. That’s why it’s in quotes, right?

A Yes.

Q Okay. Let’s show Mr. Kessler PX-1444D, please.(Plaintiff Exhibit 1444D marked.)

MS. DUNN: This is another Facebook chat that you hadwith Derrick Davis. Your Honor, we’d move to admit 1444D. The witness recognizes it.

THE COURT: Be admitted.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1444D admitted.)

BY MS. DUNN:

Q All right. So on June 18th of 2017, you write toMr. Davis, “Do you have a pole or something I can wave thisrebel flag from?” Do you see that at the bottom?

A Yes.

Q And Mr. Davis says, “I mean, you can get a Walmart polefor like 7 bucks.” You say, “I guess a thin pole would fit butit seems made to use those brass holes.” Then you say — hesays, “Walmart poles have brass grommet holders.” And you say,”Is this the kind of thing you had in mind? Doesn’t seem that aesthetic.” Then Mr. Davis says, “What are you talking about,my dude?” Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q And you say “Flagpole.”

A Yes.

Q And then if we go to the next page, he says — you saysomething we can’t see. And then he says, “No, the cheaperone. Can be weaponized.” You see that?

A That’s what he says.

Q Right. And he’s talking about the flagpole, correct?

A Yes.

MS. DUNN: Okay. We can take that down,Mr. Spalding.

BY MS. DUNN:

Q Mr. Kessler, you would agree with me, wouldn’t you, thatit was important to be completely forthcoming with the policeabout Charlottesville 2.0, right?

A Yes.

Q We’d like to show you text exchanges between yourself and Defendant Kline. They’re 1458A through D. And it may be that the quickest way to do this is to hand them to you, rather than try to show you four exhibits on the screen. That will take time. So I’m going to ask Ms. Lawyer to hand you — or to handthe marshal. And just let us know, Mr. Kessler, if you recognize those as text exchanges you had with Defendant Eli Kline from July 11th.

A Yes.

MS. DUNN: All right. Your Honor, move to admit1458A through D please.

THE COURT: Be admitted.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1458A through D marked.)(Plaintiff Exhibit 1458A through D admitted.)BY MS. DUNN:

Q So the first message in this exchange is from you toDefendant Kline, saying, “Cops want to talk to me about therally.” Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q So in mid July the police had reached out to you andwanted to know your plans. You agree with that?A I had many discussions with the police.

Q Right.

A During this time as well.

Q And you see that in the next text exchange, Mr. Mosleysays, “Just hold them off until we can talk about our plan abit more.” You see that, right?

A Yes.

Q And then you respond, “I told them all I can say is basicstuff about Antifa trying to disrupt our setup in the morningand block entrance to the park.” You see that?

A Yes.

Q And then in the next exchange you respond to Mr. Kline,you say, “It would be helpful to give them a security liaison who can tell them what we want them to know.” You see that?

A Yes.

Q Let’s show Mr. Kessler Plaintiffs’ Exhibit 1460D.Now, this is another Facebook conversation in which youparticipated. You can see your name there, right?

A Yes.

MS. DUNN: Your Honor, move to admit 1460D.

THE COURT: Be admitted.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1460D marked.)

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1460D admitted.)

BY MS. DUNN:

Q And I’m going to direct your attention to the chats fromJuly 18th of 2017. And actually, if you can get the — those two and the oneright above it, Mr. Spalding. Thank you. You say, “If the police ask you how many people we havecoming, don’t tell them. If they think we have more than 400 they might be able to help the city pull our permit.” Do you see that? A Yes. I didn’t want people speaking off the cuff andsaying something that they weren’t qualified to speak on, like attendance, that would screw up the legal issues.Q So your testimony is you didn’t want people talking about this because they weren’t qualified?

A Yeah, they had no idea. People could just randomlyspeculate and it wouldn’t be based on anything factual.Q Okay. And you say, “Just say you don’t know.”And then somebody named Wade Garrote says, “Are you guysaware of Cantwell’s conversation with Charlottesville PD? Heplayed a recording of it on his show last night. Sounds likeshe might have been fishing for an expected number ofattendees.” Do you see that?

A Yeah. They were fishing for somebody to say the wrongthing about the attendance that they had no idea about. Likethey would just randomly speculate and then they would use thatto try and deny us our permit.

Q Mr. Kessler, do you recall that after this in thisFacebook chat you say, “Privately, we can tout the 800 to athousand number, better for our enemies to underestimate us”?Do you remember that you wrote that?

A It’s possible I said that at the time. That wasn’t theactual attendance number, though. Those numbers fluctuatedthroughout the event.

Q We’ll talk about that, but you certainly agree that it’spossible you said that “Privately they should tout the 800 to a thousand number because it’s better for our enemies to underestimate us,” correct?

A Can I see that?

Q We’ll pull it up. I’m going to move on while Mr. Spalding and Ms. Lawyer find that for you. If you could look at PX-1396.

A It could have been a completely different time period.That’s why I want to know. You’re making it sound like these things were at the same time. So…

Q We’ll find it for you. It’s immediately after this.Let’s look at PX-1396. This is another Facebookconversation — I apologize. This is a text message betweenyou and Augustus Invictus. Do you see this?

A Yes.

MS. DUNN: Move to admit 1396.

THE COURT: Be admitted.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1396 marked.)

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1396 admitted.)

BY MS. DUNN:

Q In your text message to Augustus Invictus — by the way,who is Mr. Invictus?

A He is one of the — he was one of the scheduled speakersat the event.

Q And you say, “If you get a chance to speak to DetectiveKirby of the Charlottesville PD, if he asks you how many peopleare coming with you, say you don’t know.” Do you see that?A Yes. This had to do with the legal issues surrounding thepermit. When two parties are in —

Q Your Honor —

A — an adversarial situation in —

Q Your Honor.

A — litigation, that’s —

Q Mr. Kessler. Mr. Kessler.

THE COURT: Just answer her narrow question.MS. DUNN: Your attorney has time to ask youquestions.

THE COURT: Go ahead. Just ask the question. MS. DUNN: Thank you.

BY MS. DUNN:

Q You say to Mr. Invictus, “If Detective Kirby asks you howmany people are coming with you, say you don’t know.” You seethat, correct?

A Yes, ma’am.

Q So this doesn’t pertain to the general attendees. Theseare people who were coming with Mr. Invictus. And you’resaying, say you don’t know. You see that, right?A I see what I said, but the larger interpretation, I don’tknow if you’re accurate about.

Q Okay. Let’s show — you have this? All right. Mr. Spalding, please show Mr. Kessler where onTuesday, July 18th of 2017, he says — on the next page, wherehe says, “Privately we can tout the 800 to thousand number.Better for our enemies to underestimate that.” You see that you posted that, correct, Mr. Kessler?

A Yes.

MS. DUNN: Let’s show Mr. Kessler PX-3841.(Plaintiff Exhibit 3841 marked.)

BY MS. DUNN:

Q Mr. Kessler, this is your permit application forCharlottesville 2.0. Do you recognize it?

A Yes.

Q Great.

MS. DUNN: Your Honor, move to admit 1341.THE COURT: Be admitted.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1341 marked.)

(Plaintiff Exhibit 1341 admitted.)

BY MS. DUNN:

Q So this is the permit. You can see, Mr. Kessler, that’syour signature, right?

A Yes.

Q Your permit is for August 12th of 2017. Let’s show thejury the date. Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q And it’s for 10 a.m. to 5 p.m. You see that?

A Yes.

 

Q And if you look above that, there is a space where you canenter the location for which — to which the permit applies,and it says “Lee Park.” Do you see that?

A Yes.

Q It doesn’t say anything there other than Lee Park,correct? That’s what it says?

A It says Lee Park, yes.

Q And if you look at the application, it has an option torequest street closings. And you’ve checked “no.” You seethat?

A Right.

Q And the permit application also asks you to estimate thenumber of participants. And you say 400. Do you see that?A Yeah, it looks like I did estimate that number.Q Yes. Okay. We can take that down, Mr. Spalding.

 

So this was a complete fucking circus. He’s lying, he’s tipping off Antifa. He’s telling other people to lie. This is a major problem.

In his closing argument, Kolenich said “The Alt Right wanted to fight Antifa, but they wanted to do so legally”.

This amounts to a confession, and I had to dispute this in my closing argument by saying “You must look at me and my codefendants separately. Mr. Kolenich told you the Alt Right wanted to fight antifa, but they wanted to do so legally. I did not want to fight anybody, legally or otherwise, which is why I wore a body camera and insisted on close coordination with law enforcement”.

If there was anybody who should have been thrown under the bus during this trial, it was Jason himself, and him far more than James Fields, in fact. Everybody sought to distance themselves from James, and this was easy enough to do since none of us had any connection with the boy. I stood up in the last line of my closing argument and said that I believed the man was innocent of the offense, and that this was why I supported him. That, in fact, was the only defense we had to raise, that we believed in the innocence of Mr. Fields. Assenting to the outcome of his sham trial, and the guilty plea he subsequently accepted to avoid the death penalty, only assents to the element of intent the Plaintiffs had alleged. Being averse to this association after the man has pleaded guilty to murder, does you no good when you are alleged to be his co-conspirator in the crime.

Jason, actually sought a violent armed confrontation. He brought in self described racists to make this happen. He planned with others to make this happen. That covers every element of the accusation. I did none of these things, and yet I, am held equally liable to Jason Kessler, in this absolute circus of a trial, where he was the key witness for the plaintiffs.

People praised me for not throwing guys under the bus. Thanks for that, but I’ll be honest with you, I’d have done more than thrown Jason under the bus if I had known any of this. I found this out, in the courtroom. Jason was the chief beneficiary of the Plaintiffs keeping me in the damn dark the whole time. If I had known what he did, I wouldn’t have just disavowed him, I’d have sued him. I’d have every Right winger who got hurt or had to hurt someone that weekend, and I’d put together a team of Plaintiffs and we’d be fighting over the scraps of his carcass with the Reds right now.

But instead of getting thrown under the bus, Jason threw others under the bus, such as in this exchange.

 

Q And Nathan Damigo and Eli Kline were both leaders of Identity Evropa and they joined you and Mr. Spencer for weekly planning calls for Charlottesville 2.0?

A I don’t think that’s accurate.

Q All right. So in your deposition, Mr. Kessler, you wereasked this question and you gave this answer: “And you had a weekly call with Mr. Spencer, Mr. Damigo, and Mr.” — oh, I apologize. I’m reading you someone else’s deposition.

A Yeah.

Q So if Mr. Kline said that he had phone calls with you and Mr. Damigo and Mr. Spencer, you’re saying that’s false?

A No. He’s a liar. He’s a known liar.

It warrants mention here, that Jason didn’t just state this plainly. He shouted it in the courtroom like he was afraid of something Kline had said, and needed the jury to believe he was passionately denying it. There is no reason to believe that’s the case, since Jason has explicitly stated he was a principle organizer and even if the line about the conference calls was false, it’s not like Jason can deny being a planner of the event. Worse than throwing his co-defendant under the bus, it made Jason look desperate and afraid, and since much of our case rested on the fact that Eli spoke to the cops in advance of the torch march, calling him a liar was very disadvantageous to our defense. If Jason hadn’t participated in these calls, it would have more than sufficed for him to say that Mr. Kline was mistaken, and Mr, Kline had by this time stopped cooperating with the litigation, so there would have been nothing but his deposition to refute Kessler’s denial.

As for me, Jason had by this time figured out that it would be disadvantageous to throw me under the bus, but I come under the impression he made that decision during the trial as a consequence of my performance therein.

The most damage Jason did to me, was during and in advance of the event. I had precisely zero to do with the planning of UTR. There was no evidence to suggest that I was any sort of leadership figure. But Jason introduced me to the reporter from Vice. He told me to tell her that I represented the event. Although I had no leadership role, Jason sent me a text message inviting me to the “Leadership meeting”. In the wake of the chaos, he invited me to an afterparty, as described in this exchange from the trial transcript.

Q And I won’t go through all these, but just directing your attention to your text to Mr. Cantwell on August 12th at 2:18 p.m; do you see that one?

A “11 Langford Place,” yes.

Q Sorry. The other text that you sent him at 2:18 on August 12th?

A “We’re still meeting at the afterparty”? That one?

Q Correct?

A Yes, ma’am.

Q It says, “We’re still meeting at the afterparty location at 5 p.m. Capacity is only 150, so leaders and essential people only. We need to talk about how we move forward.Potentially having a press conference in the near future to get our side of the story out.” Do you see that?

A I see it.

Q And 2:18 on August 12th, that’s about a half an hour after the car attack, right?

A I don’t recall exactly what time that happened.

Q It happened at 1:41. And you invited leaders and essential people, which included Mr. Cantwell, correct?

A Yes.

While there are plenty of reasons to be unhappy with Azzmador and the Daily Stormer, Jason’s treatment of them during questioning was by no means helpful either.

Q This is a Discord post from July 28th. It is a post by Robert Ray, who goes by “Azzmador.” He says he just got done with an hours-long chat with some of the event organizers and he feels better about the thing. He says that “the plan is the same: Gas the kikes, PR war now, plenty of trolling and lulz.”You see that, Mr. Kessler?

A Yeah, I see that he said that.

Q Right. But he’s talking about the event organizers, and you and Mr. Kline were the primary event organizers, correct?

A We were, but Mr. Ray is a scumbag, and I was trying to keep him out of the event, so that’s what he was referring to, is these people staged a mutiny against me and forced to have this guy as part of the event.

MS. DUNN: Your Honor, move to strike.

THE COURT: Sustained.

MS. DUNN: Thank you.

Q Mr. Kessler, my question is whether this chat talks aboutan hours-long chat that Azzmador had with the event organizers.That’s my question.

A All I can tell you is I see what he said right here.Q I do, too. And you don’t disagree that, ultimately,Robert Ray, “Azzmador,” attended this event, right?A Yes, ma’am.

Q Okay. And you don’t disagree that, ultimately, you agreedto that, right?

A I agreed to give him a limited speaking spot, yes.

Q You agreed to have him there, correct?

A I just said I agreed to have him have a small speakingspot at the event.

Q Right. And one of the reasons you did that is because youwanted the Stormers to be there, and you knew that if you lostRobert Ray, you would lose the Stormers.

A I don’t think that’s accurate. I think the reason wasbecause he was threatening to have these people come in and saystuff like that, “gas the kikes” and do Sieg Heils and stuff, and I was trying to keep that out of my event. This guy threatened me that he would do that.

Q Mr. Kessler, my question to you is simply: Did you want the Stormers to come to the event?

A At first, I might have, but by the time I realized whatthis guy and his crew was about, I wasn’t so hot on it.

Q Okay. One other thing I wanted to ask about this, Mr. Kessler: You don’t dispute that Mr. Ray was there on August 11th?
A I’ve seen pictures of him there, so I believe he was.

Q Right. And one of the pictures you may have seen is withhis arm outstretched, macing somebody, right?

A Yes.

Q Right. Something that you know that he has referred to as”gas the kikes.” You know that?

A I’ve heard you guys make that argument. He was a very badperson. And I don’t think he should have been at the event.I’ll never associate with him again.

Q Okay. My question, Mr. Kessler, is — well, actually,maybe I should ask you this: Have you not seen the video whereAzzmador says on August 12th, “I personally gassed half a dozenkikes”? Have you seen that with your eyes?

A Yeah. It was disgusting.

Q Thank you, Mr. Kessler. Let’s talk for a second about your communications with the other defendants. You produced your phone records in this case. They are voluminous, as you would expect. I’d like for you to identify them.

MS. DUNN: Mr. Spalding, can you show Mr. Kessler3258-O.

Q Do you see this?

A Yes, ma’am.

Q Are these your phone records?

A It looks that way, yes.

MS. DUNN: Your Honor, we move to admit PX-3258-O.

THE COURT: Be admitted.

Q Now, by the way, are you going to dispute that in these phone records there are phone calls with Robert Ray?

A It could be, yeah.

(Plaintiff Exhibit 3258-O marked.)

(Plaintiff Exhibit 3258-O admitted.)

I don’t know if Kolenich explained this to Jason or not, but when you are accused of conspiracy, it doesn’t do you any good to say that in the wake of the alleged conspiracy, you dislike your co-conspirator. The question is not how you feel about him today, the question is whether you conspired with him in the manner alleged. If you tell the Court that your alleged co-conspirator is a bad guy, you are telling the Court that at the time of the alleged conspiracy, you were associating with a bad guy. So Jason goes on this whole thing about Azzmador being a problem, and then Dunn shows the phone records where he’s got the guy on the horn. It was very damning.

Jason’s testimony was so bad, in fact, that his only lawyer, asked him no questions. He wanted him off that stand as quickly as possible.

When Kessler’s lawyer, James Kolenich, cross examined Richard Spencer, he want into some bizarre line of questioning to imply that Spencer sought to take over Identity Evropa. The questioning was completely irrelevant, but the Plaintiffs did not object because they knew as well as I did that this was not helping our defense in the slightest.

The trial went on for a month, I could obviously say much more, but time constraints force us to move on to today’s exchange and what led up to it.

In late October or early November, Jason contacted me asking me basically to invite him as a guest on the show. In the process, he stated, accurately, that Augustus Invictus has been subjected to a total gag order, and I asked him if he could provide documentation for this claim. He said he didn’t have the documents. I said if he could get the documents, I’d invite him on to discuss the subject.

Instead of bothering to go an obtain this public court filing, Jason yelled at me, and told me that I didn’t understand what was important. I explained to Jason, that since I am the host of the show is asking for publicity from, I was the one who made judgments about the import of the subject matter, and he would just have to live with those judgments if he wanted my help. To this he responded “I don’t give a fuck about your podcast”. My predictable reply was “Then don’t ask to come on it” and I hung up on him.

On November 14th of this year, Jason contacted me again, this time to inform me he was writing a book, and as part of this book, he had to write biographies of all the attendees of UTR. It was for this purpose, he said, that he wanted to know if there was a name for my unique accent.

In no uncertain terms, I said he needed to do no such thing, and asked to be omitted from the book. With all that Jason has done to cause trouble and attack people, the last thing I want is him as my biographer.

He said that he would just say “sounds like Family Guy” because Jason is a fucking asshole, and no matter what the circumstances are, he will continue asking people for favors, and then setting fire to the relationship as soon as he doesn’t get what he wants.

In today’s today’s conversation, he further demonstrates his social ineptitude.

Jason appears completely oblivious to the problems he has created with his prior outbursts. He finds it totally surprising that I do not want to help him with the project I have already refused to help him with, and in which he specifically stated he would speak about me mockingly as revenge.

Notice the pattern, because it is remarkably consistent and if you ever work with Jason Kessler, you’ll have an identical experience. EVERYONE who works with him, has THE SAME EXPERIENCE.

1. Jason asks for help.

2. Jason does not get what he wants – OR – even if he is granted the help he requests, he fails anyway.

3. Jason viciously attacks the person whose help he requires.

This happens with all of his relationships, it is why he is completely alone and nobody in their right mind will work with him.

It is why he rejects White Nationalism and talks about dating non-white women after being rejected by every White woman he has ever approached.

It is why he blames his loss of Telegram followers on “bots”

It is why he immediately threw his co-defendants under the bus at the Sines v. Kessler trial.

He is a childish, toxic, stupid fucking loser, and if you have anything to do with him after this warning, you will have earned the suffering it causes.

 

Jason’s “Primary Issue” is that White women don’t want to fuck him, and thus, White Nationalism does not speak to this, so goes a Telegram post of his from not so long ago…

Ultimately, White Nationalism does not speak to my primary issues as a White Man.

I’m not sitting around quaking in my boots over black crime.

There are no Jews or illegal immigrants who are directly standing between me and what would make me happy.

The only people who have what I want are White women. I want to have a loving family.

No Jew is withholding what I want.

No black is withholding what I want.

No illegal immigrant is withholding what I want.

The fact that I can be a responsible, hard-working White man and nowhere in my life come anywhere near White women who might want to fall in love and have a family is a material problem for me and one that White Nationalism does not address.

NO! Posting pictures of White women and asking, “Aren’t they beautiful?” does not address the issue!

NO! Posting endless pictures of White families and asking, “Aren’t they great?” does not address the issue!

NO! Insulting White men by telling them to, “Man up” or some other feminist garbage does not solve the problem!

There is no way to get around the fact that White women seem to all be either left-wing lunatics or hyper-religious nutters. And that they go out of their way NOT to be available to single men.

They are literally the only race of women that crosses the street when a single man is walking on the same side of the road as them. 🤦‍♂️

You cannot be a White Nationalist if you have irreconcilable differences with White women. If you are a White man and have no conceivable way to meet single White women, you have much bigger and more immediate issues than can be blamed on any Mexican, black person or Jew.

This is an internal problem within our race: that few of our women seem particularly concerned about falling in love and having a family.

Here’s an amusing one that demonstrates Jason’s simultaneous ineptitude for and devotion to, being deceptive.

The Unite the Right Rally was the best thing that ever happened to Jason Kessler, unlike the experience of so many others. In his pathetic life, this was his moment in the sun. The day that people actually paid attention to him, even if for all of the wrong reasons.

Jason has been trying to relive that day ever since, and has talked about almost nothing else.

And as he sits to pen a book in which he slanders his codefendants and acts as though he is blameless in all that has gone wrong, like he did at the trial that bore his name, he insists this is the “last thing” he wants to speak of.

He is not desperately clinging to what little this can do for his starved ego. No… This is merely his duty…

And since nobody believes that nonsense, everyone who reads this knows he is a liar.

The last thing in the world I thought I wanted to focus on was Charlottesville.

But the truth is my upcoming article is going to have details which could (and should) demonstrate the profound courtroom prejudice towards the A11 protesters and, I believe, provide justification for overturning guilty pleas, bond rulings, and lead to the recusal of members of the court.

The evidence is profoundly more direct than what I found about the law clerks in the Sines case.

I have a moral obligation to act in such a circumstance when few others will.

You will also see the likely “courtroom insider” who has been giving Antifa bloggers unprecedented access to courtroom happenings before the newspapers themselves are aware.

 

Jason still writes for VDare. That is the only platform still giving him an outlet.

After all that he has done to harm our cause, he does not deserve to be featured on the prestigious pages of that publication.

I’ve never been big on deplatforming people, but this is a noteworthy exception.

Let VDare know that they should not be featuring the guy who caused the problems at Unite the Right, threw his co-defendants under the bus, and burned every bridge but the one they are providing.

Failing this, they’ll soon enough be added to the long list of charred overpasses attributable to Jason Kessler.

 

 

If you would like to help finance this my quality productions, I try to make this easy enough to do….

 

 

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